Bring Transparency to the top menu level!

[greenmorpher]

Here I am caught again with old man's disease -- forgetting something. In this case, forgetting where to go to add transparency to an image.

It is in the contextual menu > layer properties > click on the TINY(!!!) transparency symbol.

This is something I want to do from time to time, but in fact I have not wanted to do it for about 6 months for various reasons but mainly because I have been dealing with straight pictures and not much with stuff in advertising.

So today I needed to get transparency going and spent frustrating time trying to locate where instant transparency is. I finally found it through doing a search on this forum and reading through heaps of stuff. I could NOT find it in the PL manual.

Why, for heaven's sake, can't we have an item in the upper level of the Layer menu which says "Add Transparency"???

I've asked this before. Why must it be hidden within an item at the bottom of a contextual menu?

What about it, folks?

And sure, lot of you have better memories than me (now!) but so what? Some other image editing apps have adding transparency at the top menu level so this is not just a case of the peculiar needs of one old bloke. Lots of people use lots of other programs that have got this covered. Do you hear them complaining? I don’t think so. :

Cheers, Geoff

[Martin Huber]

So today I needed to get transparency going and spent frustrating time trying to locate where instant transparency is. I finally found it through doing a search on this forum and reading through heaps of stuff. I could NOT find it in the PL manual.

Why, for heaven's sake, can't we have an item in the upper level of the Layer menu which says "Add Transparency"???

Here on OS X, if I search in the help for "add transparency", the first result is "Create An Alpha Channel/Transparency", which forwards you to the Layer Attributes panel.

I've asked this before. Why must it be hidden within an item at the bottom of a contextual menu?

It isn't hidden in a context menu. The context menu is just one of the many ways of opening the Layer Attributes panel. Other ways are double-clicking a layer in the Layer List, using the blue "i" icon at the bottom of the layer list or using the menu command "View > Panels > Layer Attributes".

And sure, lot of you have better memories than me (now!) but so what? Some other image editing apps have adding transparency at the top menu level

Not the ones I know. And with the current menu structure I simply don't know a place for this command. Well, in fact I know a place ("Layout > Image"), but it's probably not easier to find there.

In PhotoLine everything you have to know about a layer is either in the Layer List or the Layer Attributes. The Layer List should always be open and it offers fast access to the Layer Attributes.

Martin

[photoken]

In PhotoLine everything you have to know about a layer is either in the Layer List or the Layer Attributes. The Layer List should always be open and it offers fast access to the Layer Attributes.

It would help if there were a tooltip explaining what this icon setting does:

transparency tooltip.png

Something like "Allow Transparency".

[kevjon]

It would help if there were a tooltip explaining what this icon setting does:
Something like "Allow Transparency".

Its a good suggestion, I didn't know what that check box does either.

[greenmorpher]

So today I needed to get transparency going and spent frustrating time trying to locate where instant transparency is. I finally found it through doing a search on this forum and reading through heaps of stuff. I could NOT find it in the PL manual.

Why, for heaven's sake, can't we have an item in the upper level of the Layer menu which says "Add Transparency"???

Here on OS X, if I search in the help for "add transparency", the first result is "Create An Alpha Channel/Transparency", which forwards you to the Layer Attributes panel.

Not when I search the Help and the manual, Martin, also on OS X, which come up with quite different results, by the way, when the two should be the same.

trans.jpg

trans manual.jpg

Actually, I was in error. The Manual used there was the v.18 manual. I just downloaded the v.19 manual. Searching for Add transparency got me to the index with ADDress and AutoTRANSPARENCY highlighted. Sigh!

I've asked this before. Why must it be hidden within an item at the bottom of a contextual menu?

It isn't hidden in a context menu. The context menu is just one of the many ways of opening the Layer Attributes panel. Other ways are double-clicking a layer in the Layer List, using the blue "i" icon at the bottom of the layer list or using the menu command "View > Panels > Layer Attributes".

Good, now I know. So there are FOUR ways to get to the Layer Attributes Panel but only ONE way to add transparency and it is with a tiny grayed out symbol in the Layer Attributes Panel. Terrific.

And sure, lot of you have better memories than me (now!) but so what? Some other image editing apps have adding transparency at the top menu level

Not the ones I know. And with the current menu structure I simply don't know a place for this command. Well, in fact I know a place ("Layout > Image"), but it's probably not easier to find there.

In PhotoLine everything you have to know about a layer is either in the Layer List or the Layer Attributes. The Layer List should always be open and it offers fast access to the Layer Attributes.

I do have the Layer List always open but I actually didn't know it offers access to Layer Attributes. But, you see, I didn't WANT "Layer Attributes", I wanted "Add Transparency" AND THERE IS NO COMMAND FOR THAT.

You could easily add "Add Transparency" to the top of the second group (the group of four sub-menus) in the Layer menu -- or perhaps put it on its own between the top group of commands/sub-menus and the second group of four sub-menus.

When you are doing lots of fast image manipulation, you don’t want two step solutions when one would do.

Cheers, Geoff

[greenmorpher]

Look, let’s put it this way -- the need for some immediate access to transparency is recognized in the Automask and the Autotransparency tools, but they are not nearly as useful as Add Transparency which does not have instant access. Let's bring Add Transparency to the surface just as Automask and Autotransparency are on the surface.

Cheers, Geoff

[Herbert123]

Look, let’s put it this way -- the need for some immediate access to transparency is recognized in the Automask and the Autotransparency tools, but they are not nearly as useful as Add Transparency which does not have instant access. Let's bring Add Transparency to the surface just as Automask and Autotransparency are on the surface.

Cheers, Geoff

Why not just add an option to <alt> double-click on a layer to add transparency? That's how it works in Photoshop and the background layer. Also much faster than a menu entry which clogs up the Layer menu.

[photoken]

Why not just add an option to <alt> double-click on a layer to add transparency?

One reason I can think of is that it would adversly complicate using PL because Alt+Click on a mask layer displays the mask in the main editing window. Too many different results to remember for the same physical action, you know....

[Herbert123]

Why not just add an option to <alt> double-click on a layer to add transparency?

One reason I can think of is that it would adversely complicate using PL because Alt+Click on a mask layer displays the mask in the main editing window. Too many different results to remember for the same physical action, you know....

Seems to work in quite a satisfactory fashion for Photoshop users - so far I have not heard a single complaint from students or users. All students love that option when I mention it (hundreds of students so far). Besides, it would be clicking on the layer itself, not a layer mask.

And Photoshop also uses the same modifier key for displaying a layer mask in the main editing window. If anything the addition of this option would actually help all those Photoshop users to make the transition to Photoline ;-P

[bkh]

Why not just add an option to <alt> double-click on a layer to add transparency? That's how it works in Photoshop and the background layer. Also much faster than a menu entry which clogs up the Layer menu.

This may help power users, but I guess the proposal was to make it easier to find for a beginner or if you only need it occasionally.

I'd probably locate it next to "Change layer type" – maybe one could even replace "Change layer type …" by a submenu which allows to set the layer mode, colour depth and alpha channel/transparency (for bitmap layers).

Alternatively, Tools -> Colour would be a place where I'd look for a "Transparency" menu entry.

Cheers

Burkhard.

[Herbert123]

I recall that when I looked for this option the first time, I checked the layer properties first (a panel which should always be open, in my opinion), and saw the transparency icon and checkmark. Easy enough for me.

However, I can imagine that many user may not understand the meaning behind it. A good place for this option would perhaps also be the contextual menu when a user right-clicked on a layer.

[photoken]

I recall that when I looked for this option the first time, I checked the layer properties first (a panel which should always be open, in my opinion), and saw the transparency icon and checkmark. Easy enough for me.

Yes, it's easy enough for everyone. The addition of a tooltip for that icon would make things even easier and more understandable.

A good place for this option would perhaps also be the contextual menu when a user right-clicked on a layer.

No, that's more unnecessary clutter.

This whole request discussion is an example of a solution in search of a problem, IMO.

[greenmorpher]

I recall that when I looked for this option the first time, I checked the layer properties first (a panel which should always be open, in my opinion), and saw the transparency icon and checkmark. Easy enough for me.

Yes, it's easy enough for everyone. The addition of a tool tip for that icon would make things even easier and more understandable.

Ken, you are being patronizing here. Is it easy enough for everyone? Obviously I would not have raised the matter if it was. My main point originally was that the command is hidden; you have to go through TWO levels to get to it AND that even if you go to the Help and the Manual you WILL NOT find is easily (despite what Gerhard says -- goodness knows that Help he is using, it is not like the PL Help I am seeing).

If "Add Transparency" cannot be at the top level of the menus or whatever, what bout adding it to the toolbox? Transparency tools already exist there and as far as I am concerned, the Automask and Autotransparency tools are pretty useless.

BUT what about adding an Add Transparency tool to that little little sub-box of tools? Click in a selection with it and the while selection is deleted to transparency. Double click with it on an image and as transparency layer is added?

Such a tool would b e MUCH more useful to me -- and, I suspect, a lot of other users -- than either the Automask or Autotransparency tools.

SO -- that would be a logical place for it and the tool would be logical and an easy find for a novice or occasional user.

As for your notion about the tool tip. You only see the tool tip if you are:
1) In the Layer Properties Panel -- the problem is getting there given the broken help and manual.
2) You only see it if you roll over it. (I do like the tool tip when you roll over the "Resolution" -- repeating the figure that is in the resolution space.)

And that still does not address the question of rapid and obvious access.

So how about adding a tool to the transparency tools?

Or how about saying: "Goodness, there are so many tools in that sub-box, let's throw out some of them because we an bury them two steps down in some panel or other so they cannot be readily accessed? And what about the menus? What about Change Layer Size and Scale Layer being taken out of the top level of menus and put into the Layer Properties panel -- there is a reference to size there?

Because that, I am sorry to say, Ken, is the logical consequence of your thinking in objecting to bringing Add Transparency to the surface. You are simply defending the status quo. What is at what level in the menus is not all logical at all.

Anyway -- enough. The brothers are never going to make this happen, that is obvious. They have some rooted (il)logical reason to not do it.

This whole request discussion is an example of a solution in search of a problem, IMO.

A pity you think that way when I have expressed a problem. From where I sit, your opinion is simply worthless in this matter. Sorry to say that because you contribute so much, Ken. But on this one, you are simply sitting in the corner going "Grrrr".

Cheers, Geoff

[greenmorpher]

Oh look -- ACDSee has revived Canvas for Mac. It is not yet up to Canvas X level where Mac development stopped about 10 years ago, but hopefully it will not only reach that but exceed it next year when it goes to Canvas X 16 for mac -- the equivalent of the current Canvas for Windows.

AND IT HAS TRANSPARENCY AT THE TOP MENU LEVEL.

Just like the old Canvas had/has.

And guess what -- it doesn't hurt a bit.

From Canvas Draw for Mac 'Help':

(Note: the "Image" menu includes all commands for raster image work in /canvas.)
To Add a Visibility Mask:
1. Select a paint object that does not have a visibility mask.
2. Choose Image | Add Visibility Mask. This command is not available if an Indexed or Multichannel image is selected.
Adding a visibility mask does not change the appearance of a paint object; e.g., white pixels do not become transparent. When a paint object has a visibility mask, you can select Preserve Visibility in the Channels palette. When this option is selected, Canvas Draw protects clear areas from the effects of painting and image editing.
To Create a Transparent Background:
1. Select the image object.
2. Click the Fill Ink icon in the Toolbox.
3. Select Null Ink. A visibility mask is applied to the object, and the white pixels become transparent.

--

It looks pretty good so far. Given ACDSee's long time expertise in raster, hopefully the ultimate image experience in the new Canvas will be a top raster performer. The old Canvas was very good.

Cheers, Geoff

[maxwell]

Hi,

if I like to change the background color of a layer to transparency under Photoline, I use the tool "Color to Transparenc". This tool can be found under "Tool -> Color".

Cheers

Josef