Tiff Layers

[cathodeRay]

One of the first things that drew me towards PL is that it can open Vuescan 48 bit RGBi RAW tiff files (the ones where the IR channel is saved as a separate layer). The files open with two layers: the RGB tiff image on the bottom, type 'Background', named 'Transparency', and the IR channel as a greyscale layer on the top, type 'Image' and named 'Extra'.

Being 'RAW' scans (I know they are not digital camera RAW files), Vuescan doesn't carry out any rotation directions from the input tab, so I open the file in PL, rotate if needed and hit save. Pwoof! IR layer gone! Yes, I do have 'Save Layers' on in tiif options. This is confirmed by the filesize, which drops by approx 25%. Here Pwoof! really is Pwoof!

After a bit of digging around on the forum, I found mention a few years back of incorrectly tagged tiff files and similar problems but no real solution, partly perhaps because tagged layered tiff files are somewhat non-standardised. The was a mention of 'extra sample' tag which is why I mention the 'Extra' name given to the IR channel layer.

I then noticed neither layer opened with transparency on (despite the background layer's given name) and so turned it on for the background layer, and hit save and then closed the file. File size (in Explorer) stayed the same - promising.

I then reopened the file in PL, only to find one layer (now type Image, named as per the file name). PL shows the file size as that of the four channel file, but the IR channel is now nowhere to be seen, a sort of Macavity layer. Layer Mask > Create from Alpha is available (not greyed out) but it just creates a blank white layer. Turning on mask editing just produces a blank white mask channel.

Since these files are to be archive versions of the scans (hence the 'RAW' format and saving the IR data as separate channel eg in case IR cleaning gets even better in the future), I do not want them corrupted/throwing out data or becoming partly inaccessible.

Any ideas (apart from don't do anything to the file: but shouldn't PL be able to save a file it can open)?

cathodeRay

[bkh]

Being 'RAW' scans (I know they are not digital camera RAW files), Vuescan doesn't carry out any rotation directions from the input tab, so I open the file in PL, rotate if needed and hit save. Pwoof! IR layer gone! Yes, I do have 'Save Layers' on in tiif options. This is confirmed by the filesize, which drops by approx 25%. Here Pwoof! really is Pwoof!

PL usually saves additional layers as additional TIFF pages, not additional colour channels, so there is a chance that PL may have interpreted the additional layer as a separate page. (There's an option under Preferences -> File -> TIFF whether to open such TIFFs as pages or layers.)

Of course, now that PL can use spot colours, it would be nice if the IR channel could be handled as a (transparent?) spot colour.

In any case, maybe you could create a very small one and post it here. Might be useful for testing (assuming that the developers don't have such TIFFs at hand).

Cheers

Burkhard.

[cathodeRay]

Burkhard - the 'Open Multipage TIFFS on Pages' option is unchecked, and when the file opens there are two layers, each with its own layer in the layer stack and its own layer attributes/properties panel. At this point the IR layer is clearly as it should be (a faint greyscale and yes these are Kodachromes but I find Vuescan IR now does a reasonable but not perfect, hence the reason for wanting to keep the archive with a separate IR channel, cleaning job on them with the 'Light' setting. If VS, or other, IR cleaning gets better in the future, as it has in the past, then I can reapply the improved cleaning).

I'll try and do a very small scan but '64 bit RGBi tiffs' (sorry - I said in the OP 48 bit which is of course RGB only without the IR data) and 'very small' may not sit well together!

cathodeRay

[bkh]

Strange that the IR layer just disappears. If I manually add a greyscale layer to an RGB tiff, PL can save and re-open that layer.

I'll try and do a very small scan but '64 bit RGBi tiffs' (sorry - I said in the OP 48 bit which is of course RGB only without the IR data) and 'very small' may not sit well together!

A 100 x 100 scan should be around 80 KB, don't know if you can select such a small area in Vuescan.

Cheers

Burkhard.

[Gerhard Huber]

the IR layer is opened in PhotoLine invisible, is it?
If you save documents in TIFF format, all invisible layers will be removed.
So turn it visible and it will be saved.

[cathodeRay]

Gerhard - thanks, that was it. Both layers with eye icon on => both layers saved. I did try with both layers marked/greyed but that wasn't enough. BTB, what is the max file size for attachments? I did a small tiff as suggested by Burkhard (actually two tiffs, one raw 64bit RGBi, one 48bit IR cleaned for interests sake and then zipped) but at just under 4Mb it got refused as too large and - probably me being stupid - I couldn't find anything anywhere saying what the upper limit is.

cathodeRay

[photoken]

I couldn't find anything anywhere saying what the upper limit is.

http://www.pl32.com/forum3/viewtopic.ph ... 742#p21728
Note: there are times when the forum software randomly refuses to accept valid attachments. There's no rhyme or reason to it, the only thing to do is try again later or....

[cathodeRay]

Thanks Ken, I was looking in the wrong place.